GTS9 - Posted - 10/17/2017:  19:33:32

Hello, I would like a to buy a Spider Cone Resonator Guitar; exactly which type, however, I need some help with. I have no intention of buying one and then trying to put on and remove modifications from it so that I can change the style in which it is played, I will either play a squareneck lap style with a Dobro bar or a roundneck Spanish style with fretting as well as a hollow finger slide. So what I am really trying to decide upon is what style I'd like to play in (lap or Spanish). I'll probably have more questions in the future, but right now I only have three I'm immediately concerned with.

(1) I know that lap/squareneck is played with finger picks on the middle, index, and thumb (like the bluegrass banjo), is the Spanish/roundneck played the same way, or is it typically played with just a regular pick? If the roundneck is played with a guitar pick that would be a plus in it's favor as that is the style I know on the mandolin and would require less of a learning curve. But I guess if they both require finger picks then I'll definitely have the three finger picking down should I ever decide to learn Bluegrass banjo in the future.

(2) Generally speaking, squareneck/lap style Resonator Guitar is a bluegrass and old country instrument, while roundneck/Spanish style is a blues instrument. Both of those facts are equally appealing to me. I have a mandolin which means I'm already involved in Bluegrass and also branching out into old time country. If get the squareneck then I'll have an excellent bluegrass and old country instrument which has also been proven to quite capable at blues, and that is great. If I get roundneck then I'll have an instrument which seems to be more blues orientated and will open that door wider for me (blues is something I would like to get into) and also overlaps some into bluegrass and country, and that is also great. So what I want to ask is what style seems to be more popular and appropriate in modern country and rock (considering the nature of the instrument we're obviously talking about folk, root, blues, and country rock). These are two genres I would eventually like to get involved in, and while I'd certainly need to learn something like regular acoustic guitar, electric guitar, or electric base before I could become very submersed in either, if one style of Dobro was more conducive to me at least getting my toes wet then that would be a very large positive in it's favor.

(3) A squareneck, from what I understand, is typically tuned to open G. That's just fine with me, regardless of what Dobro I get I hope I'l be able to play it that way. However, in regards to the roundneck, it seems it's more common to tune it different ways, mainly standard, open G, and open D. On the roundneck is any tuning more, I guess, expected than any other (especially in certain genres) and does any tuning have any natural disadvantages or advantages compared to the other ones?

I'll really appreciate any feedback I get. Thank you.

Edited by - GTS9 on 10/18/2017 08:53:58

wlgiii - Posted - 10/18/2017:  06:51:42

Way back when, I asked myself the same questions, then went out and got a squareneck mainly because it looked so cool. But back to your questions-

1- I've seen folks play Spanish style with finger picks, a flat pick, or even no picks. (If you're playing solo and want those syncopated bass notes, it's tougher with a flat pick.)
2 & 3- I play in high G, E and C6 tuning. High G is pretty versatile overall; that's probably why it's the most common. E & D (same tuning, a step apart) work well for bluesy/rocksy. C6 is really versatile in giving you 6th chords, relative minors, and lets you swing along with the rock/country/blues. It takes some getting used to, though. You can try out high G, and retune to D or E, or A6 with the same strings to try them out.

As for bar vs bottleneck: a bar feels "right" to me, but I know guitarists better than I'll ever be who can't quite grasp it (pun intended). You may have to try both and see what suits you.

billmccloskey - Posted - 10/18/2017:  06:52:24

okay, I'll make a stab:



1. While Squareneck is usually played with finger picks, there are noticeable exceptions of Squareneck players who play with a flat pick. You can play the blues on a squareneck, as well as bluegrass, and these days, there are very few limitations: squareneck players play blues, bluegrass, jazz, rock, folk, country, you name it. Check out Jerry Douglas and Rob Ickes to see the possibilities of the instrument.



2. Roundneck players are usually playing blues.



My personal opinion is that lapstyle, squareneck playing is the most versatile and exciting style to play these days.

Edited by - billmccloskey on 10/18/2017 06:52:57

cb56 - Posted - 10/18/2017:  06:54:09

Haha, seems like you pretty much have the guitars figured out and want to play country bluegrass and blues. My advice, get one of each!

DaveInAL - Posted - 10/18/2017:  06:55:09

First, welcome to the hangout! Your post was a bit hard to digest . Breaking it up in paragraphs would help and probably get more responses.

There are a lot of misconceptions in your post. I'll address a few, but a little reading here on the hangout and listening to artists play each type of resonator on You Tube will answer many of your questions.

Square neck resonator is played face up with a bar and usually a thumb pick and two metal finger picks. While this is the most common method, there are artists who have deviated from this. It is usually tuned to GBDGBD, but other tunings are used. Square neck resonator is common in bluegrass and country, but many artists have taken it far beyond its roots.

Round neck resonator is played more like a conventional acoustic guitar and can be played with thumb and finger picks or flat pick and fretted or with a slide (or both). It is not limited by any means to blues.

Before I would invest in an instrument and the time and effort to learn it, I would do a lot of listening and research. Good luck with whatever you choose and there are many folks here who play both that can be of help for specific questions.

chrisakeley - Posted - 10/18/2017:  08:01:31

I've played both square neck and round neck and my strong impulse is to agree the other Chris, CB56, and say buy both.

That said, I'd encourage you to ask yourself a question: do I want to be the person playing in the style that everyone else is playing, or do I want to always be a bit different?

Round neck is arguably a more versatile technique and can be played on a reso as well as a flat top acoustic or any electric guitar. I play round-neck slide on acoustic and electric. Following Ry Cooder and Duane Allman, I use bare fingers on my right hand. No flat pick, no finger picks. It's a blast. Blues is an option but not the only option. Listen to Cooder's slide solo on John Hiatt's "Lipstick Sunset" or on his own "Jesus on the Main Line" and you'll have a sense of round neck versatility.

Square neck is different. Outside bluegrass circles, it's downright weird. I find this irresistibly attractive. I suspect others on this forum do, too. Playing lap style is transferrable to electric lap steel and a starting point for pedal steel. That's about it.

Play round neck and you run with the 6 string herd. Play square neck and most people most of the time will be surprised and (hopefully) intrigued to hear you. Noodle on that a bit.

Final note: there are no wrong answers in the choice you're looking to make.

GTS9 - Posted - 10/18/2017:  08:55:37

Thanks for the advice so far guys.

Weird, when I first wrote my question and copied and pasted it in it did have paragraphs. Should be fixed now.

Slidennis - Posted - 10/18/2017:  08:59:55

Right, get one of each. Resistance is futile. Both types of guitar have their advantages and disadvantages depending on the circumstance.

You are going to have to make your own decision. You have quoted the norms/boxes that seem to abound out there is the world. If you like some of those boxes pick the one you are most comfortable with and go with that one - bluegrass? - squareneck?. But the norms are not cast in concrete. You can do anything you want with either instrument. The guitar is not the restriction - it's all in the player's head.

Finger picks? As has been said the bluegrass prescription is finger picks. So what! Tut Taylor didn't fill that prescription. Others play their own way. I like to play bare naked - no picks, just what God gave me, fingers with nails.  But you should do what you want to do.

You can play any type of music on either type of guitar. As I said, the instrument is not the limiting factor. I do think there are some styles that require fretting the notes. If you lean/think that way maybe a roundneck is the way to go. But for the most part either axe will chop the wood in any given forest.

Tunings - they put those grear thingies on the headstock so you can tune them any way you want to. Either guitar can be tuned in any manner you prefer or imagine trying. There is the consideration on a roundneck to keep the string tension within the limits of what the construction can handle though. I don't recommend a high bass G tuning on a roundneck but a low bass G tuning should be ok, Just check your total string tension. So do not feel that because you have one type of guitar that it has to be tuned only one way. Open minds like lots of open tunings. You mention the open G (I assume that is high bass G) and open D tuning. If you look at those tunings in terms of the intervals between the notes for each string they are fairly equivalent. Any tune where you play the melody notes in a G tuning can be played in the D tuning if you start one string lower. But sure, it will be in a different key. Still, if you like resonator guitars get both types. Start with the type that fits best with what you are playing most now or what you are most comfortable playing and then get the other down the road. Oh, they do make resonator mandolins too. And you can slide on those. And then get a Weissenborn. And then get an electric lap steel or two. And don't overlook the pedal steel. How about a squareneck resonator ukulele? Yeah, they are out there too. Too many instruments, so little time.

Welcome to the slippery slope of slidin'.

Dennis

MarkinSonoma - Posted - 10/18/2017:  09:32:43

First of GTS9, please do us all a favor and include at least your first name below your "handle."I have no chance of remembering "GTS9" and it seems like an awkward way to address a person.

I can, and have written long posts with the best of them over the years, but let's simplify your question. Forget about the resonator aspect and (and "hubcaps" on top) in discussing these guitars. You're choosing between an acoustic version of the Hawaiian lap steel guitar vs. a "Spanish" guitar. Don't even think so much about dobro = bluegrass/old country vs. roudneck resonator= blues. One of my favorite guitarists for decades has been Mark Knopfler, and he is likely more associated with an old National metal body guitar in the minds of quite a few people than even the old blues guys were. And one of his most famous songs with Dire Straits featuring the National was the decidedly "unbluesy" Romeo & Juliet.

Both are members of the guitar family of instruments and though there is some crossover in roles, they are very different beasts. If you're going to choose one or the other, the fork in the road leads in very different directions.

Also, are you a singer? I have done plenty of lead vocals over the years while playing lap style dobro, but the fact of the matter is that Spanish guitar, regardless of its particular makeup and contstruction is overall much more conducive to singing than lap style guitar. 

If you choose lap dobro, I suggest you immerse yourelf in GBDGBD tuning to where you feel comfortable with it before you fool around too much with other tunings. This tuning is more or less the equivalent of EADGBE standard tuning on Spanish guitar. Or since you play mandolin, G tuned dobro is the equivalent of GDAE on that instrument. 

There is another thing to consider: "cool factor." The lap style dobro is enjoying its greatest popularity ever these days, and I saw an interview with Emmylou Harris where she said dobro players have kind of a "swagger" about them. That does it for me!

Edited by - MarkinSonoma on 10/18/2017 09:34:24

tomkatb - Posted - 10/18/2017:  10:00:59

Buy one of each!

When I started I had some amount of arthritis in my left hand. The lap guitar is no issue with that. As I liked blues a lot I bought a brass tricone. Not exactly right for blues. More of a miscellaneous instrument.

Then I bought a Brass biscuit cone. Now that is a blues machine.

A neighbor is one of the rather famous guitar makers. He made me a wonderful spider bridge instrument in maple. Does bluegrass and country without the amp.

But i have always loved old country music. So I bought a Gibson lap steel.

See how it happens? Fortunately the skills sort of translate to all of them. The lap steel is a bit different. Mine are tuned in 3 keys. High G, D, and C6.

PhilNBend - Posted - 11/04/2017:  18:05:27

You have gotten some good advice. One thing you need to know about resonators is that they typically require more maintenance and upkeep. If you buy a used resonator online (or in person), assume that the resonator cone will need to be replaced and you will have to buy one from one of the various cone sellers. It is not hard to replace a cone, but factor that expense into your cost. Also, if you buy new, the lower priced resonators tend to cut costs in the resonator cone and the saddle. If you go this route, be prepared that you may need (at some point in time) to upgrade both. On a spider cone type resonator, the cone is harder to damage than on a biscuit cone resonator, but they can easily be damaged, usually by overtightening the tone adjustment screw. Depending on where you live, you may find it difficult to find someone qualified to work on your resonator and may (as I was) be forced to learn how to do this yourself. For warped cones, there may be problems with warranty claims - they may say that you caused the damage - plus you are on the hook to pay $100+ in shipping costs. My point is that if you are going to get into resonator guitars, from my own experience, be prepared to learn how to maintain them.

Doctor Proctor - Posted - 11/05/2017:  05:46:42

quote:

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Originally posted by GTS9

 I have a mandolin .

 

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and play Bluegrass.

If you are going Squareneck.  Go buy a set of banjo picks ( thumbpick and 2 metal fingerpicks) and see if you can get used to wearing em