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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: Tone Bar Size


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.resohangout.com/archive/53883

mug - Posted - 08/03/2020:  18:13:26


Is the Shubb SP3 shorter than the Shubb SP2?

Slidennis - Posted - 08/03/2020:  18:41:19


According to the Shubb website, both the SP2 and the SP3 measure 2.875" along the "flat" playing surface of the bar. The SP2 has the added length of the rounded nose.

 



shubb.com/steel/

mug - Posted - 08/03/2020:  20:23:44


I read that they were the same size but in the pics it looked smaller. I was wanting something smaller than the SP2.

P2gee - Posted - 08/04/2020:  06:57:43


I started out using a SP2 and while it is a very good bar the length of tended to ball up my somewhat pudgy hands. I'm using a E.G. Smith Bluegrass bar now which is significantly shorter. It is a big change in length from the SP2 and does take some getting used to, but once you do I find it works very well for me.

SamCy - Posted - 08/04/2020:  12:35:06


Here is a link to Greg Boyd who sells the E.G. Smith bars, including the bluegrass version. Beard used to make a "shorty" version of their tone bar, and Charlie (Slide Pro STS Bar) has been known to make custom length versions of his bar.



gregboyd.com/product-category/...s/page/3/

MarkinSonoma - Posted - 08/04/2020:  16:31:38


I have had an E.G. Smith as part of my "bar museum" for years, I just checked the length on mine and went to the Greg Boyd site to confirm.  In comparison to the Shubb bars - exactly the same length on the playing surface: 2 7/8 inches or 2.875 inches. 



But length isn't everything. It's how it fits in your hand that counts. 



Wait - did I just say that?



The indentations on the sides have a distinct curve where you can really get a good grip, sort of like a less beefy Charlie's dobro bar. 



 


Edited by - MarkinSonoma on 08/04/2020 16:33:24



 

SamCy - Posted - 08/04/2020:  17:46:48


Is the E. G. Smith "bluegrass" bar the same length as the "standard full size" bar?

P2gee - Posted - 08/05/2020:  07:43:49




 


 


 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 



 


Edited by - P2gee on 08/05/2020 07:44:42


PeterJ - Posted - 08/05/2020:  09:36:32


I haven't tried the SP3, but I used an SP2 for years. I now use a Dunlop Lap Dawg. It's definitely a bit shorter and fits my hand better. It's definitely not a beautifully machined piece of stainless steel, like the E.G. Smith, but it works well for me, and the plating has held up on the two I have.

MarkinSonoma - Posted - 08/05/2020:  10:39:47


Thanks for this Peter, since they don't bother with the length of the E.G. Smith bluegrass bar on the Greg Boyd site. 



So the bluegrass bar is about 1/8" shorter than the "regular" Smith bar. 



I wonder  in a blindfold test if I would notice any difference?

MarkinSonoma - Posted - 08/05/2020:  10:52:25


Thank goodness for hangout members putting out a little effort.



Dunlop didn't get around to listing dimensions and weight of the Lap Dawg in their site. 



Peter, what is the length of the Lap Dawg?

 



 



 

P2gee - Posted - 08/05/2020:  11:44:21


quote:

Originally posted by MarkinSonoma

Thanks for this Peter, since they don't bother with the length of the E.G. Smith bluegrass bar on the Greg Boyd site. 



So the bluegrass bar is about 1/8" shorter than the "regular" Smith bar. 



I wonder  in a blindfold test if I would notice any difference?






I also have the standard E.G. Smith bar.  The pictures don't show it so well but the the bluegrass bar is a little smaller in all dimensions, not just length.  Being overall smaller it feels easier to fling around the neck.........in my experience.

Slidennis - Posted - 08/05/2020:  12:14:37


Elderly is pretty good about listing measurements for the bars they carry. Their figures generally match what I have measured in the past. Here are a couple that I have around here (that I can still identify by make and model).



The Dunlop #926 Lap Dawg is 2.75" and 5.5oz.



The Dunlop #927 Long Dawg is 3.1" and 5.6oz.



The Dunlop #925 Stevens style bar is 2.875" and 5.35 oz.



Shubb Gary Swallow is 3.0625" and weighs 4.4 oz.



Scheerhorn Stainless goes 2.9375" and goes 5.2 oz.



Shubb SP1 is 3.375" and 5.0 oz. ( weight from Elderly, that seems light to me).



Shubb SP2 is 2.875" and 5.6 oz.



That gives you an idea of the playing surface length.  And generally that will run between 2.75" and 3" for a six string neck bar.  The hand fit is as important if not more important, as has been said.  Measurements for that are near impossible to come by which is why we all have a collection of slides laying around.  You've got to try a few before you get to one that fits your grip.



Hope that helps (probably just confuses things).  It would be nice to have a reference where we could collect all the stats on the bars that are available.



Dennis


Edited by - Slidennis on 08/05/2020 12:22:37

Oboe Cadobro - Posted - 08/05/2020:  13:30:52


I bought an E.G. Smith as my first slide and found it to be too short in height, plus a bit too light.



Then I bought a Scheerhorn from Rob Ickes, the shape of which totally didn't fit my hand.



Then I bought a Beard 2010, which was a decent height and weight at 4.9oz but was too short so that I couldn't hold it all the way in my hand. 



Then I tried a Long Dawg, which was long enough but didn't have the right shape for me to be able to hold it comfortably.



A few years ago, I got a Charlie's Tone Bar, custom made with 20/10 angles and oversized at 3.1 inches. At 6.4oz, it is heavier than any other bar, but it is very easy to hold for me, produces a ringing sound without much pressure, and has a crisp edge and great angle for easy pull-offs.

badger - Posted - 08/05/2020:  19:39:53


Find something that fits your hand and use it. Consider for a moment all of the great music that was made with a Stevens bar. As my bass instructor once put it, "it's not your equipment that's holding you back..."

Three_Eyed_Willy - Posted - 08/07/2020:  14:22:43


quote:

Originally posted by MarkinSonoma

I have had an E.G. Smith as part of my "bar museum" for years, I just checked the length on mine and went to the Greg Boyd site to confirm.  In comparison to the Shubb bars - exactly the same length on the playing surface: 2 7/8 inches or 2.875 inches. 



But length isn't everything. It's how it fits in your hand that counts. 



Wait - did I just say that?



The indentations on the sides have a distinct curve where you can really get a good grip, sort of like a less beefy Charlie's dobro bar. 



 






I purchased one of these from Greg a couple of months ago. It's a good size and weight, but the serrations on the top of the bar were quite uncomfortable. I had to take the sharpness off of them with a file and some crocus cloth.



I actually prefer the Shubb GS. It fits my hand just fine.



 

crk - Posted - 09/06/2020:  08:46:59


I am a small guy 5'6" with small hands, was using a Scheerhorn bar I got from Rob Ickes, and found it just a bit large and heavy for me, though I am a beginner so I saved it in case I 'grow into' it as I get better. Tim Scheerhorn was nice enough to make me some custom Scheerhorn bars and they are PERFECT for me. He only took 1/8" off the length which he thought would be perfect. I thought 'how could 1/8" make any difference' but waited to see. When they arrived I was really surprised at how much difference that made, not surprisingly Tim was spot on. The weight and length are perfect for my smaller hands.

maxmax - Posted - 09/28/2020:  07:04:59


Hi Guys, hope you all are doing well!

Can I ask a basic question... Does the back of the bar touch the back of your palm when you all hold it, or does it only rest in your fingers? The Long Dawg is the only bar I've tried that touches the back of my palm. It gives a secure feeling, but at the same I don't have issues with shorter bars either. Just curious what other peoples experience is?

Also, is there anyone out there currently making or willing to make a longer, 3+ inch "boutique" bar? I like the Long Dawg and am not sure what else to expect out of a bar, but just curious to try something else.

Cheers,
Max

resotom - Posted - 09/28/2020:  08:49:39


I have a Long Dawg tone bar that is exactly as you described. I use it all the time.
My back-up tone bar is a Ron Tipton #1 tone bar that I use as well just for diversification.
On both bars, I put a small piece of tape where my thumb rests so I use only that side of the bar when playing. There may be two different angles on each bar and I am comfortable doing this..
For those reso players out there, which angle do you prefer ? 10 percent or 20 ??

Slidennis - Posted - 09/28/2020:  09:45:07


quote:

Originally posted by maxmax

Hi Guys, hope you all are doing well!



Can I ask a basic question... Does the back of the bar touch the back of your palm when you all hold it, or does it only rest in your fingers? The Long Dawg is the only bar I've tried that touches the back of my palm. It gives a secure feeling, but at the same I don't have issues with shorter bars either. Just curious what other peoples experience is?





Also, is there anyone out there currently making or willing to make a longer, 3+ inch "boutique" bar? I like the Long Dawg and am not sure what else to expect out of a bar, but just curious to try something else.



Cheers,

Max






Like most aspects of the tonebar, I think whether the back of the bar hits your palm is one of those personal preference things.  I play the Lap Dawg just because it feels more comfortable than other bars to me.  I have tried a Charlie's Bar that felt very good too.  They feel more manuverable to me.



I don't prefer the Long Dawg as much largely because I do feel the palm thing.  Same goes for the Shubb SP-1.  But it's probably a hand size difference between us.  But I do like the longer bars for playing an eight string at this point.  



Then there is the cutaway versus non-cutaway ends. The Long Dawg has the two slanted ends.  I like the steeper angle end.  The Shubb SP-1 has a bullet end and a flat/square end.  So that might matter.



If it feels good to you, go with it.



Longer bars - over 3" - besides the Long Dawg the Shubb SP-1 might be the most prevalent from what I see among Dobro players at 3.375" long.  Wayne Johnson at Innovative Guitars makes a 3.5" inch brass bar. And you might be able to talk with him about a particular design.   You can see the brass bar on his facebook page.   facebook.com/media/set/?vanity...886081914



I am sure their are other tonebar makers out there which would be willing to work with you. I just don't know who to suggest.  Bullet bars, much beloved among pedal steel players, are also available in 3"+  lengths. 



 



 


Edited by - Slidennis on 09/28/2020 09:49:23

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