HighLonesomeF5 - Posted - 05/05/2024:  04:27:49

Since the price is so close, what are the differences/similarities?

Edited

Edited by - HighLonesomeF5 on 05/06/2024 09:36:09

hlpdobro - Posted - 05/05/2024:  07:08:13

I don't recommend high end guitars.

I do recommend that interested parties either (a) play the guitar or (b) discuss their preferences with the builder.

How would I, or anyone know what characteristics are important to you?

hp

AK Slider - Posted - 05/05/2024:  15:02:50

About the pursuit of the ideal tone, I’m haven’t chimed in lately so here’s what I think. Have you ever noticed how the same instrument can sound so different depending on who’s playing it? That’s why you should always try out as many as you can before investing in your forever dream guitar. Your hands, your attack, your style, all factor into how an instrument responds. Plus one person’s idea of great tone may or may not agree with yours. I could tell you which guitar sounds the best to me on my lap but that could be misleading.

Lounge Primate - Posted - 05/06/2024:  07:16:28

I’m wondering Greg, when you chose your current dobro, how important was tone vs. how important was volume? Obviously it’s a blend of both, but the term “banjo killer” jokingly comes up a lot with really good dobros. For pros such as yourself, I’m assuming when on stage (playing to a microphone) it is an important factor?



With that in mind, is one of those Beards more of a banjo killer than other? (probably a question more for Howard).

Edited by - Lounge Primate on 05/06/2024 07:17:59

hlpdobro - Posted - 05/06/2024:  08:10:35

quote:

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Originally posted by Lounge Primate

With that in mind, is one of those Beards more of a banjo killer than other? (probably a question more for Howard).

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There's my hot button. I absolutely HATE the term "banjo killer". So you'll get no help from me on that. I know LOTS of loud, crappy (to my ears) guitars. <blah>



My take on guitar selection is that my absolute primary consideration is TONE..TONE..TONE.



I have a preferred tone in my head and my first consideration is, how easy is it to transfer that tone in my head to the tone my hands can produce on a particular guitar.  If the tone meets/exceeds my expectations, that's a guitar I might want to own. If not, NOTHING else matters and I move on.



My head. My ears. My hands. Those are my tools.



You have different tools.

AK Slider - Posted - 05/06/2024:  09:00:26

I agree with Howard about that, it’s the TONE more than volume. But I also look for responsiveness which is related to volume. I like an instrument that’s alive and has more sound to give when I dig in more. When I chose to order my maple L Body I went to IBMA and played about 30 high end dobros, some for sale and some that were there with their owners. It was about the tone and responsiveness.

HighLonesomeF5 - Posted - 05/06/2024:  09:36:48

My OP has been updated.

HighLonesomeF5 - Posted - 05/06/2024:  09:37:59

quote:

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Originally posted by AK Slider

I agree with Howard about that, it’s the TONE more than volume. But I also look for responsiveness which is related to volume. I like an instrument that’s alive and has more sound to give when I dig in more. When I chose to order my maple L Body I went to IBMA and played about 30 high end dobros, some for sale and some that were there with their owners. It was about the tone and responsiveness.

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I would like to thank you for the absolutely great music that you have posted on youtube.  

daver - Posted - 05/06/2024:  10:05:30

quote:

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Originally posted by HighLonesomeF5

Since the price is so close, what are the differences/similarities?

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If you read the website description, you will know as much as I do.  Both Finnish birch E-sized bodies. Different coverplates and aesthetics. "Scoop" type baffle and soundposts for the JS Standard, open body for the Radio E.  How that translates to what you want to hear, I defer back to Howard's succinct advice.

Are you attending ResoGat (July 10-14, Wilkesboro, NC)?  There will be a couple hundred resos there, many for sale, even those that aren't are often very generously shared.  I think in a two or three day period you would get all the hands-on information you would ever need.

AK Slider - Posted - 05/06/2024:  10:08:08

quote:

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Originally posted by HighLonesomeF5

quote:

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I would like to thank you for the absolutely great music that you have posted on youtube.  

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You're welcome, and thank you!

AK Slider - Posted - 05/06/2024:  10:12:37

Back to the original question, I haven’t played the Radio model, but I played the JS standard at ResoSummit for at least a half hour and I really liked it, it was my favorite one Paul had there.

Lounge Primate - Posted - 05/06/2024:  10:13:39

quote:

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Originally posted by hlpdobro

quote:

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Originally posted by Lounge Primate

With that in mind, is one of those Beards more of a banjo killer than other? (probably a question more for Howard).

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There's my hot button. I absolutely HATE the term "banjo killer". 

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Ha! Good to know your hot button Howard ;-)

I suppose "banjo killer" belongs in the same drawer as "arm-pit guitar". 

*volume*

Greg, if you don't mind expounding some more, Rob Ickes often talked about liking the volume of rosewood matched with a spruce top, his thinking that it worked well for D-28's (that he was sort of competing with 'volume-wise'), and you, I'm assuming, tried those 'horns, but maple was the sound (and volume) you preferred. Did you find their punch similar at all?

islandgirl - Posted - 05/06/2024:  11:18:15

My husband has a Bourgeois Banjo Killer model guitar, and I have to say, even though it has a very unfortunate name, it is one of the most stunning guitars I have ever played. My banjos are very nervous around it, though.

MarkinSonoma - Posted - 05/06/2024:  13:50:18

I played a Bourgeois Banjo Killer several years ago in a Bay Area store (Gryphon) - great guitar and plenty loud when needed. Which I can say for my 2011 Martin dread from their Custom Shop (Adirondack top/Madagascar rosewood back and sides) which I ordered through Gryphon. The moniker doesn't bother me - as Tim Scheerhorn has stated in a couple of interviews over the years one of the main reasons he originally decided to try his hand at building reso guitars was for increased volume. He was playing an old Dobro in jams and getting killed by banjos. I feel his pain - for many years my main guitar was my circa 1933 Model 37 with a lug cone. Sweet vintage Dobro tone, but I would go to jams and get buried by banjos every time. But what a difference - the new to me circa 1936 Regal-built Model 37 I acquired from Steve Toth in December has a slightly deeper body than the California-built 1933 and it is similar to what Mike Auldridge played for may years. It also has a Quarterman cone.  It has good volume when I push it - but of course not in the same league as many large body modern squareneck  resophonic guitars.

At least "banjo killer," quality of tone aside serves a meaningful purpose. Brooks mentioned the annoying (to me) "armpit guitar" - that expression is pretty much the province of pedal steel players on The Steel Guitar Forum, as a way to differentiate steel guitars from standard guitars. No one outside of that forum in my experience ever uses the term "armpit guitar."

I haven't played the Beard Josh Swift models - either the standard made from Finnish Birch ply or the solid curly maple. But I have played a few Radio Standard models since they hit the market. Nice guitars, and they reminded me quite a bit of the Beard Deco-Phonic. IMO they weren't in the same league as the Mike Auldridge signature, also made from Finnish Birch ply. Even when sharing the same E body style, Paul's design and the internals on the Auldridge to my mind puts that model in a whole other category. So apparently it has a lot more to do with overall design rather than the choice of tonewood? That same day at Gryphon I also played a Beard R solid mahogany, and a rosewood/spruce Nati-horn, formerly the Rob Ickes model. I music preferred both guitars to the Radio Standard. Just more going on to my ears. 

Brooks mentioned Rob's rosewood/spruce Tim-builts and how Rob has mentioned the D-28 vibe of the wood combo. HIs first Scheerhorn in the early 90's was a maple guitar, then he played the rosewood/spruce for a long time. And in recent years he's  playing Byrl guitars, and has come back around to maple. Go figure.

Edited by - MarkinSonoma on 05/06/2024 14:05:50

MarkinSonoma - Posted - 05/06/2024:  15:16:58

Second to last paragraph above - "music" should be "much." Didn't catch it in time to correct the typo. 

Lounge Primate - Posted - 05/06/2024:  15:25:26

I think the term “armpit guitar” hits my intolerant raw nerve the way “banjo killer” hits Howard’s ;-)

MarkinSonoma - Posted - 05/06/2024:  17:57:38

Alluding to what Howard wrote earlier, though I haven’t been around nearly as many Resophonic guitars in my life that he has, I have been around enough to have come across some that were indeed very loud - but they definitely sounded crappy.



In some cases apparently the selling point was the loudness so that the guitar could hang in there against a banjo player completely lacking in subtlety and any sense of dynamics, but the tone grated on me. Banjo players aren’t the only ones - there are some fiddlers who tend to play on 9 or 10 a lot of the time. I’m often amazed how much volume can be had from such a small instrument.

Edited by - MarkinSonoma on 05/06/2024 17:58:22

AK Slider - Posted - 05/06/2024:  19:30:34

quote:

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Originally posted by Lounge Primate

quote:

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Originally posted by hlpdobro

quote:

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Originally posted by Lounge Primate

With that in mind, is one of those Beards more of a banjo killer than other? (probably a question more for Howard).

---

There's my hot button. I absolutely HATE the term "banjo killer". 

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Ha! Good to know your hot button Howard ;-)

I suppose "banjo killer" belongs in the same drawer as "arm-pit guitar". 

*volume*

Greg, if you don't mind expounding some more, Rob Ickes often talked about liking the volume of rosewood matched with a spruce top, his thinking that it worked well for D-28's (that he was sort of competing with 'volume-wise'), and you, I'm assuming, tried those 'horns, but maple was the sound (and volume) you preferred. Did you find their punch similar at all?

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My shopping spree was over 15 yrs ago so my impression of the R/S is a bit fuzzy, but I think I was more attracted to the punch and power of the maple. The tone that really got under my skin and inside my head, to quote Howard, was Jerry's Scheerhorn with AKUS as well as the tone that Randy Kohrs pulled out of his maple L body. If you’ve heard my recordings I imagine some of you reading this might say, "So what happened?" Lol! Eventually if you play long enough you end up sounding like yourself I guess, and after playing that Beard Josh Swift standard for a good while I remember thinking I could get my sound out of it. It has a plastic parabolic baffle much like the Scheerhorn if that means anything.

hlpdobro - Posted - 05/07/2024:  07:17:01

Since Greg is also a dynamite banjo player I wondered about his thoughts on the potential for musical self-immolation.

How would that work, anyways?

h

p.s. - Yes "responsiveness" is so important, to me at least.

AK Slider - Posted - 05/07/2024:  07:48:31

quote:

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Originally posted by hlpdobro

Since Greg is also a dynamite banjo player I wondered about his thoughts on the potential for musical self-immolation.



How would that work, anyways?



h



p.s. - Yes "responsiveness" is so important, to me at least.

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If you mean burnout I've definitely been there, done that! 

hlpdobro - Posted - 05/07/2024:  07:57:59

I meant the potential of a "banjo killer" dobro actually killing the banjo, while you played one or the other.

Ahhh...nevermind. I'm just being silly.

Carry on!

Lounge Primate - Posted - 05/07/2024:  08:05:55

And Greg played pedal steel. Amazing right hand work and wonderful tone.
Greg, which has more influence on your right hand, pedal steel or banjo?
both?
(Yeh, I’m straying, but interesting topic slightly ….very slightly…..related to OP).

FrederickPatterson - Posted - 05/07/2024:  09:40:30

"Plays like butter" does it to me. 

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Originally posted by Lounge Primate

I think the term “armpit guitar” hits my intolerant raw nerve the way “banjo killer” hits Howard’s ;-)

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MarkinSonoma - Posted - 05/07/2024:  13:36:53

Another one that bugs me, you hear it mostly with flattops but occasionally with resonators is referring to a guitar as a "box."

"Hey,  that's a nice box you got there!"

AK Slider - Posted - 05/07/2024:  22:44:25

quote:

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Originally posted by hlpdobro

I meant the potential of a "banjo killer" dobro actually killing the banjo, while you played one or the other.



Ahhh...nevermind. I'm just being silly.



Carry on!

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Hahaha, I get it now. Good one hip! Although that's the beauty of my gig...and I often use this in our show...I like being the banjo player because when I'm playing dobro I don't have to listen to that dang banjo!