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Hipshot DoubleShot - Beard MA-6 or National Scheerhorn-L?

Nov 23, 2022 - 5:35:46 PM
501 posts since 11/28/2012

I’m looking to install a Hipshot DoubleShot on a gigging instrument to toggle between Open D and High Bass Open G. I would also install a rolling nut and locking tuners.

I love both my Beard MA-6 and National Scheerhorn maple. Both have the Fishman Nashville / JD Aura setup. If given a choice, I would prefer to use the National Scheerhorn as the gig warrior, and the MA-6 as a home studio instrument. But I can go either way.

I’d like to select one guitar for the Hipshot DoubleShot.

I’ve researched the topic here, although I may not have found all the related posts.

From what I’ve gathered, at least one person had some dimensional issues with the install on his or her National Scheerhorn-L.

I also read that with some instruments, there is added harmonics and sustain. As the MA-6 is already highly sensitive and resophonic, this might be a concern when amplifying.

In short, I’m looking for any inputs that might guide me in selecting which guitar for the DoubleShot install. Any general advice also appreciated.

Oh…I also sweeten my thirds by a few cents. As the thirds are on different strings (Open D vs. Open G), do I now need to tune straight up ?

Thanks much!

Nov 23, 2022 - 6:10:12 PM

501 posts since 11/28/2012

Never mind the “sweetened thirds” question. I understand the fine tuning screws allow for this capability…so good there.

Nov 24, 2022 - 12:23:43 PM

Brian E

USA

5 posts since 8/6/2017

Jamie
Here's video of Greg Booth's National Scheerhorn with Doubleshot. Seems just fine on this guitar
Here

cheers

Nov 24, 2022 - 2:51:23 PM

501 posts since 11/28/2012

Thanks Brian! Greg's guitar with DoubleShot looks great, and fantastic playing. Very helpful!

Nov 24, 2022 - 5:44:34 PM
Players Union Member

daver

USA

757 posts since 9/2/2008

I am glad to hear you're considering the Doubleshot. I've enjoyed mine and use it on every gig. My back enjoys not carrying an extra instrument.

The Doubleshot is comparable in length to a standard tailpiece. And the mounting hole is in the exact position of a standard tailpiece. I've installed them on a Beard Odyssey and on an Appalachian with zero modifications. I think a friend put one on his James. And as mentioned Greg Booth has one on his National/ Scheerhorn.

The roller nut has a fixed spacing, and is likely to be wider than the bone nut. On the Odyssey, the nut hangs outside of the slot a little bit. I have paid zero attention to that overhang about 2 days after installation. Since it's designed as a drop in to replace a Beard nut, it fits the slot perfectly. I had to shim the nut slot on my Appalachian.

The biggest dimensional issue is that the reso won't fit in a standard reso case. I've used both the Beard extra deep case and the Travelite TL-60.

DISCLAIMER: THE FOLLOWING PARAGRAPH IS THE MUSING OF AN INVETERATE TINKERER. THIS IS WHAT I DID, NOT NECESSARILY WHAT YOU SHOULD DO. DON'T DO ANYTHING YOU DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE DOING. CAVEAT LUTHOR...

When I installed mine, I removed strings 2 through 5. I used a tapered door shim and slipped it under the coverplate strap just until contact was made between the coverplate strap and the top of the saddle (NO FORCE!!). Then I removed the outer two strings. The spring force of the unloaded cone put just enough pressure on the shim to keep the cone from moving. Then I removed the tailpiece screw, replaced the original tailpiece with the Doubleshot, stung up strings 1 and 6 and tuned them until the shim was released. This way, the cone stayed in place during the swap.

Nov 24, 2022 - 6:49:19 PM

501 posts since 11/28/2012

Thanks Dave. I appreciate your info sharing. I’m away from my guitars at the moment, so I can’t measure…but I’m assuming my National Scheerhorn and Beard MA6 have different nut slot dimensions. Maybe not. But I’m guessing the roller nut would not be a seamless drop-in on the Scheerhorn.

I’ve decided the National Scheerhorn will get the DoubleShot. I like it for hard gigging, and the MA-6 for studio.

My mechanical and DIY skills are average at best. I’m thinking my National Scheerhorn is overdue for a tune-up and I’ll likely see if I can get a professional DoubleShot install (+ locking tuners and roller nut) as part of that bundle.

Anyone know if this is something Bobby Wright might do? Or any other suggestions for getting the work done professionally along with a setup/tune-up?

I have a few assorted guitar cases lying around and I’ll see if any of those might work. My Beard MA6 came in a slightly deeper TKL case, so maybe I’ll get lucky.

Thanks!

Nov 25, 2022 - 8:22:28 AM

106 posts since 3/20/2015

I also have a Double Shot I installed on my Beard Odyssey and it was exactly as Dave described. Everything just dropped into place. My guitar was due for a good cleaning so I didn't do what Dave did to hold everything in place since was going to be taking off the coverplate and removing the cone anyway.

I'll also repeat what I remember saying from a previous question about the install, and that is that you don't really need the locking tuners. I was considering the switch but it would have required drilling new holes in the headstock which I really didn't want to do. I then looked over at my pedal steel and realized that I've never seen a pedal steel with locking tuners and they handle changing tension on the strings constantly. I've been perfectly happy without locking tuners and my guitar stays in tune without any issues. Nothing wrong with locking tuners and they certainly won't hurt but they are not necessary.

Nov 25, 2022 - 1:10:31 PM

501 posts since 11/28/2012

Thanks Mark. I think I’ll order the Double Shot and roller nut and then size up my comfort level with a self install. Your comments on the pedal steels without locking tuners makes sense.

So do you pitch up from Open D tuning to G tuning? Have you (or anyone else who cares to comment) ever popped a string when engaging the lever for pitch up ?

Thanks for your insights.

Nov 25, 2022 - 2:20:08 PM

106 posts since 3/20/2015

I go from open D to open G. I've never broken a string. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever broken a string since I started playing Dobro about seven years ago. I've broken strings on my lap steel, but that's got more to do with the tailpiece design. I do change strings pretty frequently. It would be unusual for me to have a set on for more than three weeks or so and sometimes a lot less.

Nov 25, 2022 - 2:32:18 PM
Players Union Member

psikes

USA

181 posts since 4/14/2010
Online Now

The Doubleshot came installed on my Beard Jerry Douglas and I could not be happier. I do like the locking tuners but mostly for how easy they make changing strings. I have not broken a string as of yet and the only time I did was on a non Doubleshot dobro when going from G6 back to G tuning. Once you have the strings settled in very little fine tuning is needed. Just one really happy Doubleshot owner/user.

Phil

Nov 25, 2022 - 4:30:36 PM

501 posts since 11/28/2012

Thanks for the additional info, very helpful.

I just examined the specs on the roller nut. I don't have a digital caliper, but I measure 1/8" nut slot width on my National Scheehorn, and the roller nut is .155". Some minor modifications needed for install perhaps?

My Beard MA6, on the other hand, looks pretty much spot on for a drop-in nut replacement. Again, this is just a ruler measurement, but there appears to be a measurable difference between the Scheerhorn and the Beard nut slot.

Also my nut width is 1 7/8", vs the roller nut 2.005". So about 1/16" overhang on both sides of the nut, and fractionally wider string spacing I assume (vs my current stock setup).  Just like Daver said.

Edited by - JC Dobro on 11/25/2022 16:36:15

Nov 25, 2022 - 4:51:47 PM

106 posts since 3/20/2015

The nut slot width on my Odyssey is 1.890 and the roller nut has a slight overhang on either side. The roller nut measures an actual 1.950 width with my calipers. The roller nut extension that goes in the nut slot is measuring closer to .165 thick on mine. I have bone nut blank from Beard that measures .185 thick and 1.950 wide. Don't know if that helps, but it's about all I got :)

Nov 25, 2022 - 5:11:09 PM

501 posts since 11/28/2012

Yes Mark, that is extremely helpful, thanks!!

Nov 27, 2022 - 2:00:45 PM

92 posts since 6/10/2011

I have a doubleshot on both my MA6 and my Scheerhorn . No problems (I brought them to Hagerstown to have the Beard folks install them) . I LOVE the locking tuners for the restringing convenience. As for choosing which to gig with…I have had a couple of TOO close calls with drunks who were attracted to my resos. I decided that since my Scheerhorn is mostly irreplaceable
I gig with the MA

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